JavaScript is disabled. I have a book that even say's the no#5 is narrower than the no#1. How do I tell which Remington Rolling Block Action I have The M1867 rifle became very popular among civilian hunters in Sweden, particularly for moose hunting, which led to Husqvarna Vapenfabrik producing about 85,000 rifles with the M1867 rolling-block action for the civilian market, in addition to the more than 100,000 they made for the armed forces. Later Model 1897 was not catalogued in these two scarce chamberings. The following letters correspond to the months of the year, for example B=January, L= February and so on: The prices below reflect the common refinished variation. We may never know. Actions on this contract had serial numbers as well and date of 1868. One of the largest contracts received by Remington was from Egypt. The difference is minor, the Norwegian rifles have brass buttplates and head of the cleaning rod, and steel mounting bands, while Swedish rifles have iron furniture. It nevers ceases to frustrate me when you look at or purchase a No.1 Sporter with matching serial numbers and it it isn't even possible to determine the year of manufacture. Thanks in advance Tennessee Snuffy Posted January 22, 2020 This may be some help: https://www.gunandgame.com/threads/remington-model-6-date.122023/ The official military designation for the cartridge was '12mm Remington' from 1879.[4]. An expert rifleman, Remington claimed, could fire 17 shots a minute with the rolling-block rifle. Is there a cut off serial number for a Rem No 4 rolling block 22 being and antique? [16] In Danish service it was replaced by the M/1889 KragJrgensen. These figures, taken from Roy Marcot's book, Remington Rolling Block Sporting & Target Rifles, are educated guesses because Remington's records for these changes simply do not exist. [citation needed], Esposito, Gabriele, The Paraguayan War 186470: Osprey Publishing (2019), Jowett, Phillip, Latin American Wars 1900-1941: Osprey Publishing (2018), Hernandez, Edwin "ARMAS DE FUEGO USADAS EN LAS LUCHAS CIVILES Y POR LOS CUERPOS ARMADOS DOMINICANOS (SIGLOS XIX Y XX)", Pankhurst, Richard "Linguistic and Cultural Data on the Penetration of Fire-Arms into Ethiopia", United States occupation of the Dominican Republic (19161924), Learn how and when to remove this template message, "The military rifle cartridges of the Dominican Republic: from .50-70 to 5.56mm", "From Picturesque Landscapes to Views of War, Honduras through Postcards", "Military rifle cartridges of Peru part I: South America's most pugnacious country? near the frame that identifies the year and month of My best guess would be 1896, 1897 or 1898. These easily concealable revolvers have distinct characteristics and are synonymous with both law enforcement and the hoods they pursued. Loomis Action Type: Single Shot In late spring 1866, Samuel Remington crossed the Atlantic to demonstrate the rifle in Europe. In fact, as early as 1908, the Remington company had come out with a semi-automatic rifle, the Model 8. Ed. In reality, Spain cancelled the receipt of close to 5,500 .43 Spanish-caliber rifles remaining in the contract, as the in-country licensed production had caught up with demand. by roundtop Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:15 am, Post We know of several low 3000 rifles with 1874 patent dates. I don't think you're gonna find any readily available ammo for this one. I'm no expert but I find it hard to believe that a Rolling Block with a Silver Presentation Plaque was made in 1874 when it has a plaque is dated 1879. Sweden: 237,000-257,000 rifles and carbines, including conversions of older rifles to rolling block. The quickest identifying feature is the mounting of Breech Block and Hammer on screws rather than pins. Rare. The technical storage or access is strictly necessary for the legitimate purpose of enabling the use of a specific service explicitly requested by the subscriber or user, or for the sole purpose of carrying out the transmission of a communication over an electronic communications network. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Most of the original 10,000 Remington rifles had serialized barrels. These rifles had the locking-action (with half-cock safety) that was used in the Springfield Model 1871. Serial number- N/A. The price for each barrel was slightly higher, but the better design reduced misfire damage and ultimately resulted in cost effectiveness. Additionally, the designers improved the lock by replacing two lockscrews with a lockplate. These revolvers were designed with a snub-nose barrel, which makes it [], The Colt 1860 Army revolver, also known as the Colt U.S. Cavalry revolver, was widely during the American Civil War. Today I purchased an early no#5 rolling block rifle. Remington Rolling Block? | The Firearms Forum A tremendous amount of variation exists here, with differences as indicated below. Spain purchased over 90,000 rifles in three contracts from 1869 to 1873. They may be found in every condition from near excellent to poor, however, they are one of the most sought after given their First World War connection. The action was extremely strong, and could easily withstand the increased pressure of the new smokeless powders coming into use by the late 1880s. /* RSA 160 wide tower */ That might be a possiblity since the barrel is marked " ST" but has no set trigger Anything is possible, but I doubt the 1874 date but who knows and the frustration continues. Back in June 1876, less than three years after the Remington company received his letter of kudos, George Armstrong Custer took his cherished rolling-block sporting rifle with octagonal barrel on what would be his last campaign. According to Rem records the No. In the early 1870s, Remington boasted in an advertisement that its sporting rifle was the preferred arm for hunting purposes on the Plains; its simplicity and durability especially commending it for frontier use. Among buffalo hunters, Remingtons heavy-barreled sporting rifle was the second most popular killing machine, behind only the Sharps. Using barrel codes (such as those listed above) to date the manufacture are reliable on Remington rifles, as the company rarely changed barrels on a customers rifle. on top flat, and equipped with an Austrian Werndl type rear sight, three screw retained barrel bands and long saber bayonet lug. Listed are the four sub-categories in addition to cataloged generic variants manufactured after 1874 and priced accordingly. Introduced in 1901 it was available in 5 calibers from 22Short thru 32 long. You notice that Remington used a smaller firing pin for it's Number 5 smokeless actions compared to the larger firing pin in the Number 1. by Uechi Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:53 am, Powered by phpBB Forum Software phpBB Limited, Topics related to Pre - 1898 Remington Rifles. Blue Book value: 90% - $700 80% - $500 70% - $400 Remington 'Round Top' Rolling Block Restored google_ad_height = 125; Advertised commercially from 1875 through 1902, this .43 Spanish caliber Remington Rolling Block accounts for largest number of production, with something over 1.5 million sold from 1869 to 1910. Screw retained barrel bands, tang markings prior to 1887 have E. REMINGTON & SONS with 1874 as the final patent year. Left-over Egyptian models were catalogued by Remington up to 1882 and were sometimes advertised as French Model. I got the book from Buffalo Arms. Not consenting or withdrawing consent, may adversely affect certain features and functions. The 1920 train robbery led to their deaths and those of three lawmen. This was the first quantity contract sold overseas by Remington in 1867. The .50-70 rolling block rifle remained the standard arm of the New York State Militia until the late 1890s. Only hard copy evidence is first contract of 30,000 rifles signed in London on 30 June, 1869, as the others were likely destroyed by a fire at Remington factory in 1939. The technical storage or access is required to create user profiles to send advertising, or to track the user on a website or across several websites for similar marketing purposes. One model of Swedish military M1867 rifles modified to use the 12.1744mmR centerfire cartridge was the "gevr m/1867-74". Production probably increased during the later years of production so dividing total production by the years of production (14,400 per year) would not help with providing an accurate date for your rifle. Original rear sight is missing the elevator and the front is a replacement steel blade in front sight base. These are difficult to price, but normally reap a far higher tag than the standard 1879 Argentine model. In 1880 Kongsberg Vpenfabrikk delivered 72 conversion kits for the rifles which allowed less expensive 22LR ammunition to be fired from the M1867 for training. Quite possible you've seen the rifle. Model 4 Rolling Block | Remington - RemArms Without a subpoena, voluntary compliance on the part of your Internet Service Provider, or additional records from a third party, information stored or retrieved for this purpose alone cannot usually be used to identify you. The early Remington rolling blocks (and all other commercial American firearms) used black powder as the basic propellant for all ammunition until the smokeless, nitrocellulose-based powders became available to the U.S. civilian market in the mid-1890s. Come join the discussion about optics, ammo, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, hunting, accessories, classifieds, and more! This variation is part of 9,000 to 13,000 surplus Greek 1869 Contract Models that were diverted from Greece and sold to France during Franco-Prussian War of 1870-71. This rifle appears to have been converted to 25 RF as a "5" is struck over . One had a "379" number, and the others had 4-digit numbers. Johnnie Bruguier was both French Canadian and Sioux and learned to straddle both worlds. However, as mentioned most of the M1867 were modified after they were sold to civilians, and most collectors seem to agree that the modified arms are worth a lot less. 1879." Two other Sioux attacks were also thwarted, and the cowboys completed their incredible drive with the loss of just one man. On both tangs it has the #79 stamped. It appears that many Rolling Blocks made in 1873 and up may well have spent considerable time either in storage at Remington or a hardware store etc. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. The frame is toning to a medium gray-brown patina with areas of silvery case-hardened patina. Smooth walnut buttstock and forend with steel Schnabel remain in very good plus condition showing a tiny hairline crack at the upper tang and scattered light handling marks. History is a guide to navigation in perilous times. This may be determined by attempting to chamber a .43 Spanish cartridge of which .125" will protrude if in the original caliber. 100,291 such rifles were delivered by 1916, and used to equip rear-line troops. Remington Model 1871 Rolling Block - .50-70 Govt | D4 Guns All have 35.5" barrels, except where indicated. Two-line address on tang started with REMINGTON'S and April 17, 1866 patent. Production of the Model 2 started in 1873 and lasted until 1910. Ed. Advertised commercially from 1875 through 1902, this .43 Spanish caliber Remington Rolling Block accounts for largest number of production, with something over 1.5 million sold from 1869 to 1910. Serial number- 13632. Essentially a Spanish Model rifle, with two bands and 30.5" barrel, all chambered for .43 Spanish cartridge. Nearly all these rifles display heavy usage and pitting along the wood-to-metal fit areas and are found in good condition at best. Remington No. 1 Rolling Block Rifles (Rem. No. 1) - CHUCKHAWKS.COM Your annual membership will bring you in contact with those who share your Remington interests. (See more on the Remington company in the February 2006 Guns of the West department.). The most comprehensive and authoritative history site on the Internet. Most were sold on the international market; however, thousands of the guns in various calibersfrom .32 to the more powerful .44-77 and .50-90 were sold and put to use in the American West. As late as 1918, bandidos armed with rolling blocks were still raiding border settlements, but they found themselves outgunned by U.S. lawmen and state militiamen. It gave all the information you asked for. Remington Rolling Block Serial Numbers - Remington Society Barrel 36", with long saber bayonet lug and three barrel bands spring retained. These - along with the repeating rifles - were dropped from further testing. Guatemala was a prolific customer of Remington's Rolling Block since 1870. The Remington-Rider rolling block rifle is a 19th century design, patented around 1863 by a Remington employee named Leonard Geiger and improved over the next few years by Joseph Rider, who was the Remington factory superintendent. Your membership also includes attendance at annual RSA meetings, annual historical seminars at Remington-related locations, and participation with fellow Remington collectors at all the major gun shows in the U.S. Click on here to take you to the sign-up page. Any Argentine Model without the stamping over the chamber, and having a short saber bayonet lug is one of 2,500 ultra-rare Honduran contract rifles, which were nothing more than modified surplus Argentine variants. It has breech block like no#1 except it has small fireing pin. However a couple are known with both the 1874 tang stamp and the side stamp. All carried the three-line Remington tang markings with the last patent date of March 16, 1874. They all have numbers on the side of the tang that's only visible with the butt stock removed. by roundtop Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:40 pm, Post Several different cartridges and rifles were considered by the commission. Nov. The Remington Model 4 is a rolling block, solid-breech, hammerless, takedown, top-ejection rifle. . Rolling-block rifles were used against Muhammad Ahmad's Ansar Dervishes during the Mahdist War, including at the Siege of Khartoum where General Gordon met his end. The original caliber of Greek Model was .42 Russian Berdan, which is practically identical to .43 Spanish, aside from the larger diameter neck and bullet of the latter. This version of Spanish Model was modified from existing stocks of surplus over-runs of Remington .43 Egyptian caliber rifle. Hi Clark, Nice rifle. France practically put Rolling Block tooling into full production following 1914-15 World War One French Contract. by Uechi Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:07 pm, Post As usual, I was wrong. By this time calibers were limited to 7mm Mauser and .30/40 Krag chambering. Rolling block serial # | Graybeard Outdoors In 1867, the United Kingdoms of Sweden and Norway was the first military to adopt the rifle as the standard military rifle. Sold later as surplus by the French to American military arms dealers such as Schuyler, Hartley and Graham. Realistically speaking, any Remington Rolling Block rifle whether re-chambered or modified from other versions that were sold by the company or its agents Schuyler, Hartley & Graham, (which would by 1900 become M. Hartley and Company) in .43 Spanish caliber was listed as "Spanish Model". Among the known purchasers of the surplus Spanish Model rifles was Meiji Era Japan, which since 1868 had made at least three sizeable orders of the surplus Remington rolling block rifles of the 1868 Swedish contract. Remingtion firearms After leaving two wounded cowboys at the fort, Storys party of 28 pushed on, and in late October 1866, north of Fort Kearny, they faced even greater oddsan estimated 500 Sioux warriors readying for an attack. [18][19], The French acquired 210,000 Egyptian rolling-block rifles to make up for a shortage of the standard-issue Chassepot and Tabatire rifles during the Franco-Prussian War. Rem No 4 rolling block cut off serial number 1899? The first Remington rolling block introduced in the smokeless period was the Remington Model 1897. During the 43-year period, there were 356,000 guns sold. If it is i've got one of the first no#5's. V1-C1 Barrel Length: 26 Bore condition: Fair, Your email address will not be published. These rifles had the locking-action (with half-cock safety) that was used in the Springfield Model 1871. Sweden manufactured dozens of domestic variants based on Remington action produced by Husqvarna, Carl Gustaf and other makers. Later models were produced in .30-06 Springfield, 757mm Mauser, and 850mmR Lebel. A whole host of different Arabic markings may be encountered. I am grateful that John says the No 4 is probably an antique. First advertised in late 1896. The following serial number Production was halted in 1888 and the last rifles were decommissioned in 1940. Some factory carbines have both saddle ring and sling swivels. We found some records of serial #s and years of production at the factory but they had serious conflicting information so would be of no help in establishing the exact year of production for your rifle. Hunters, lawmen, adventurers, homesteaders and many others appreciated the strong, accurate and well-made Remington rolling block. google_ad_slot = "4659516359"; The British Empire purchased rolling-blocks to arm the Egyptian Army during the 1870s. Said I never had much use for one, never said I didn't know how to use it. Earlier models were supposed to be changed to this final design, but it is still possible to find M1867 with the original sights intact. Loomis, was introduced in 1890 and produced through 1933. Meacham of St. Louis, and they were also in demand at gun shops in more out-of-the-way places. If you are correct then the stock is not original to the serialized parts or the rifle was made special order from parts at the factory made in 1874. Tang markings of Kjobenhavn Tojhuis and year indicate a Danish copy which is very common in the United States. Remington action was fitted to surplus .58-caliber muzzle-loading Springfield parts that were transformed into a breechloader. Early muzzle plugs were a short, conical dowel made of wood, but soon a brass cup with a cut out for the front sight replaced it in service. [22], Along with the Sharps rifle it was one of two rifles probably used more than any other by the buffalo hunters who hunted the American bison herds in the 1870s and 1880s. During the American Civil War, gunsmith Leonard M. Geiger designed the basic action, in which the shooter rolled the breechblock backward with the thumb and inserted a cartridge in the breech, before the block rolled forward and the interlocking hammer cocked in one fluid motion. Production of the Model 2 started in 1873 and lasted until 1910. If you could show a picture of the plaque someone might have some knowledge of the persons involved. rolling block serial number JCP, I just removed the buttstocks of four number 5 Rolling Blocks I had access to, and they all carried the "batch" numbers on the side of the upper and lower tangs.